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	<title>Comments on: Genesis 1:6</title>
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	<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/</link>
	<description>"Mann trakht und Gott lakht"</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 06:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: danithew</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-607</link>
		<dc:creator>danithew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 17:24:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-607</guid>
		<description>I believe the following is the quote about &lt;em&gt;rakia&lt;/em&gt; (the Hebrew or semitic word translated as firmament) from Kevin's article (that Kevin is referring to):

&lt;blockquote&gt;In Hebrew cosmology, the raqîa' or "firmament" was believed to be a solid dome, supported by pillars.57  The raqîa' in turn was closely associated with the celestial ocean, which it supported.58 In the lower half of Facsimile 1, we have the raqîa' (1) connected with the waters, as with the celestial ocean, (2) appearing to be supported by pillars, and (3) being solid and therefore capable of serving itself as a support, in this case for the lion couch. The bottom half of Facsimile 1 would have looked to J-red very much like a microcosm of the universe (in much the same way that the divine throne chariot of Ezekiel 1–2, which associates the four four-faced fiery living creatures with the raqîa' above their heads on which God sits enthroned, is a microcosm of the universe). The Egyptian artist's perspective is not necessarily a limitation on J-red. The stacking effect of waters apparently both being supported and acting as a support would have suggested to J-red the Hebrew conception of the raqîa'.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;Joseph also took Facsimile 2, figure 4 (the mummiform hawk with outspread wings in a boat) as a representation of the raqîa', the figure answering "to the Hebrew word Raukeeyang, signifying expanse, or the firmament of the heavens, also a numerical figure, in Egyptian signifying one thousand." The Book of Abraham uses two alternative English words to translate raqîa': firmament, which highlights its solidity, and expanse. English expanse derives from Latin expandere, "to spread out"; this translation highlights the verbal root from which raqîa' derives, raqîa' which means "to spread out (from beating)," and from there simply "to spread out." I would suggest that to J-red, the outspread wings of the mummiform hawk made for a very natural representation of the rq'.59&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This quote refers to &lt;a href="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/abr/fac_2" rel="nofollow"&gt;facsimile 2&lt;/a&gt;.  (follow the link to see the picture and some corresponding explanations)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe the following is the quote about <em>rakia</em> (the Hebrew or semitic word translated as firmament) from Kevin&#8217;s article (that Kevin is referring to):</p>
<blockquote><p>In Hebrew cosmology, the raqîa&#8217; or &#8220;firmament&#8221; was believed to be a solid dome, supported by pillars.57  The raqîa&#8217; in turn was closely associated with the celestial ocean, which it supported.58 In the lower half of Facsimile 1, we have the raqîa&#8217; (1) connected with the waters, as with the celestial ocean, (2) appearing to be supported by pillars, and (3) being solid and therefore capable of serving itself as a support, in this case for the lion couch. The bottom half of Facsimile 1 would have looked to J-red very much like a microcosm of the universe (in much the same way that the divine throne chariot of Ezekiel 1–2, which associates the four four-faced fiery living creatures with the raqîa&#8217; above their heads on which God sits enthroned, is a microcosm of the universe). The Egyptian artist&#8217;s perspective is not necessarily a limitation on J-red. The stacking effect of waters apparently both being supported and acting as a support would have suggested to J-red the Hebrew conception of the raqîa&#8217;.</p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p>Joseph also took Facsimile 2, figure 4 (the mummiform hawk with outspread wings in a boat) as a representation of the raqîa&#8217;, the figure answering &#8220;to the Hebrew word Raukeeyang, signifying expanse, or the firmament of the heavens, also a numerical figure, in Egyptian signifying one thousand.&#8221; The Book of Abraham uses two alternative English words to translate raqîa&#8217;: firmament, which highlights its solidity, and expanse. English expanse derives from Latin expandere, &#8220;to spread out&#8221;; this translation highlights the verbal root from which raqîa&#8217; derives, raqîa&#8217; which means &#8220;to spread out (from beating),&#8221; and from there simply &#8220;to spread out.&#8221; I would suggest that to J-red, the outspread wings of the mummiform hawk made for a very natural representation of the rq&#8217;.59</p></blockquote>
<p>This quote refers to <a href="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/abr/fac_2" rel="nofollow">facsimile 2</a>.  (follow the link to see the picture and some corresponding explanations)</p>
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		<title>By: danithew</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-606</link>
		<dc:creator>danithew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 17:17:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-606</guid>
		<description>Kevin, thanks for providing that explanation.

There is a DMI post titled &lt;a href="http://mormoninquiry.typepad.com/mormon_inquiry/2007/02/biblical_cosmol.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;"Biblical Cosmology"&lt;/a&gt; that also has some interesting information or ideas.

I'm seeing in some places that Jewish cosmology has an idea of "seven heavens" or "seven firmaments."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin, thanks for providing that explanation.</p>
<p>There is a DMI post titled <a href="http://mormoninquiry.typepad.com/mormon_inquiry/2007/02/biblical_cosmol.html" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Biblical Cosmology&#8221;</a> that also has some interesting information or ideas.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m seeing in some places that Jewish cosmology has an idea of &#8220;seven heavens&#8221; or &#8220;seven firmaments.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Barney</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-605</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Barney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 17:13:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-605</guid>
		<description>Expanse and firmament are two alternate translations of Hebrew raqiya', which in ancient Hebrew cosmology is the dome above the earth separating the atmosphere from heaven. There was a celestial ocean above the dome, and when God "opened the windows of heaven" it would rain.

The English firmament derives from Latin firmamentum, and refers to the solidity of this barrier.  The English expanse derives from Latin expandere and refers to the dome having been stretched out by beating it, as with a hammer.

For more on the raqiya', including cites to previous LDS studies, see my &lt;a href="http://maxwellinstitute.byu.edu/publications/bookschapter.php?bookid=40&#038;chapid=168" rel="nofollow"&gt;"The Facsimiles and Semitic Adaptation of Existing Sources,"&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;em&gt;(this post was edited slightly to provide the link - I hope Kevin doesn't mind - danithew)&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Expanse and firmament are two alternate translations of Hebrew raqiya&#8217;, which in ancient Hebrew cosmology is the dome above the earth separating the atmosphere from heaven. There was a celestial ocean above the dome, and when God &#8220;opened the windows of heaven&#8221; it would rain.</p>
<p>The English firmament derives from Latin firmamentum, and refers to the solidity of this barrier.  The English expanse derives from Latin expandere and refers to the dome having been stretched out by beating it, as with a hammer.</p>
<p>For more on the raqiya&#8217;, including cites to previous LDS studies, see my <a href="http://maxwellinstitute.byu.edu/publications/bookschapter.php?bookid=40&#038;chapid=168" rel="nofollow">&#8220;The Facsimiles and Semitic Adaptation of Existing Sources,&#8221;</a>.</p>
<p><em>(this post was edited slightly to provide the link - I hope Kevin doesn&#8217;t mind - danithew)</em></p>
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		<title>By: danithew</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-604</link>
		<dc:creator>danithew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 16:46:28 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I like comparing the Hebrew with the Arabic just to see how often similar semitic roots are used.

I throw in the Spanish because it's another language I've studied.

This is a way for me to ponder a single verse each day plus to fit in a little language study.

I was half hoping that some people would be interested in throwing in the translations from their mission languages.  If you want to put the latin in the comments, that would be great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like comparing the Hebrew with the Arabic just to see how often similar semitic roots are used.</p>
<p>I throw in the Spanish because it&#8217;s another language I&#8217;ve studied.</p>
<p>This is a way for me to ponder a single verse each day plus to fit in a little language study.</p>
<p>I was half hoping that some people would be interested in throwing in the translations from their mission languages.  If you want to put the latin in the comments, that would be great.</p>
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		<title>By: john f.</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-602</link>
		<dc:creator>john f.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:53:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-602</guid>
		<description>I wonder whether you have considered using the Latin instead of the Spanish in conjunction with the Hebrew and Arabic versions.  That might make for a fascinating juxtaposition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder whether you have considered using the Latin instead of the Spanish in conjunction with the Hebrew and Arabic versions.  That might make for a fascinating juxtaposition.</p>
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		<title>By: Broz</title>
		<link>http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-601</link>
		<dc:creator>Broz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:20:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blognitivedissonance.com/2007/03/30/genesis-16/#comment-601</guid>
		<description>Is expanse and firmament just talking about the atmosphere?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is expanse and firmament just talking about the atmosphere?</p>
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